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Author: speedychonchon | Created: 2019-05-28 00:41:08
Subject: Alpine 2
Hi all

I have just downloaded all the concurrents and I have some issues launching a race with the xml provided.
Speedy, ChonChon, Bobbin and Rat Man are missing. Outch ! For the first two it's my mistake : I have named them with a "2019" suffixe in Torcs but not on the TRB (and I can't edit the driver name in TRB). I'm sorry for that.
For Bobbin and Rat Man, I had a quick look at the files and I saw that they are named Tiger and Tiger Too in the code.

Must we run the first race of the season with 4 contenders missing ?

Last Edited: 2019-05-28 09:15:34 by speedychonchon
    Author: dummy | Created: 2019-05-28 02:41:05
    Subject: Re: Alpine 2
    speedybots_2019.xml (renamed "Speedy 2019", "ChonChon 2019" to "Speedy", "Chonchon")
    Yes it's Chonchon not ChonChon!
    _all_tracks.xml ("driver message" 0)

    mouse_2019.cpp (renamed "Tigger", "Tigger Too" to "Rat Man", "Bobbin")

    There are 3 or 4 "Makefile" with "mouse_2019" in it.

    Success! Hope I didn't forget something.
    Last Edited: 2019-05-28 02:41:05 by dummy
    Author: timfoden | Created: 2019-05-28 12:56:49
    Subject: Re: Alpine 2
    Ah, sorry about that. Last minute changes to support the Tiger Team with new driver names from the same code base... and I didn't test after making the zip files -- which I should have done.

    Anyway, the changes documented above by dummy seem to work correctly, and I'll make sure to fix these issues for the next race.

    Cheers, Tim.
    Last Edited: 2019-05-28 12:56:49 by timfoden
    Author: wdbee | Created: 2019-05-30 08:40:44
    Subject: Re: Alpine 2
    Hi All

    There are more issues here:

    Dummydrivers and SpeedyBots do not compile with the provided project files, had to add modifications as described by Tim for VC2013.

    Robotec does not start.
    SpeedyBots does not race and blocks the track all over the race (Best Laptime > 3 min, often driving in first gear).
    Dummydrivers never drive a valid laptime in race.

    Will try a race without these fillup teams.

    Last Edited: 2019-05-30 08:40:44 by wdbee
      Author: dummy | Created: 2019-05-30 09:00:05
      Subject: Re: Alpine 2
      Hi Wolf-Dieter,

      It seems Tim could run with Dummy and Speedy. What's the difference to your setup? Speedy only touches the wall at the tunnel entry here.


      @Tim: Can you send me (daniel [dot] schellhammer {at} and wdbee the changed Dummy and Speedy, if you changed something?
      Last Edited: 2019-05-30 09:10:06 by dummy
        Author: timfoden | Created: 2019-05-30 10:11:05
        Subject: Re: Alpine 2
        As far as I remember I had to add the "/SAFESEH:NO" to the linker options for bots that only had a .vcproj and didn't supply a .vcxproj.

        I don't remember changing any source code other than for the "Tigger"->"Rat Man" changes in Mouse, and the names in the Mouse and Speedy .xml files. It'll have to wait until I get home this evening before I could check for sure though.

        @wdbee: Perhaps there's some settings files that didn't get copied for these cars?
        Last Edited: 2019-05-30 10:14:02 by timfoden
          Author: wdbee | Created: 2019-05-30 11:24:46
          Subject: Re: Alpine 2
          Hi Tim, hi Danny,

          the issues with the bots while qualify and race are not permanent.
          Sometimes a bot works, sometimes not.

          If an autobot and a robotec qualifies with a valid laptime, they have the same best lap time.
          (Except the first qualifyer, starting with different start conditions compared to all the others, a known TORCS bug.)

          BTW, I think this is not what we should do, same car, same robot, same setup( and if possible with different accounts to get the 2 extra points for both teams). For me this means just to steal points from all teams behind. In addition using different accounts would be a clear conflict with "9. Register just one user".

          I do not belive, that I missed something while preparing the bots.
          Maybe there are uninitialized variables used. Especially if I switch on the computer and start TORCS the issue raises very often. Restarting the race again and again, the behaviour changes. Having all bots qualify well does not mean all bots drive well at race. Using VC2013 it happens for my bots as well, but very seldom compared to danny's. Using VC2008 or VC2010 before I never had such issues with my bots.

          I will try to get a race with all bots working, but to be honest, I'm very limited in time for the next two years.
          In addition I will be abroad for business sometimes and maybe I cannot setup my bot for all races as it should be.

          Have a nice day

          Last Edited: 2019-05-30 11:24:46 by wdbee
            Author: dummy | Created: 2019-05-30 15:45:01
            Subject: Re: Alpine 2
            >different accounts to get the 2 extra points
            No one has 2 accounts. It's not even possible to create an account at the moment. We tried hard. And Tim and I lose those 2 points in every race, because we don't want to be bored with only 6 cars racing ;)

            >Using VC2013 it happens for my bots as well
            Couldn't you use Linux for the championships. It's free after all. If Windows was free I surely would hunt down those bugs, but they don't happen on my setup (or maybe 1 in 100 times). I already found one of those after the test races and since then nothing happened at all.
            Last Edited: 2019-05-30 15:56:20 by dummy
              Author: wdbee | Created: 2019-05-30 17:01:07
              Subject: Re: Alpine 2
              Well, racing a fast bot twice makes all following teams get 2 points less.
              For me it does not make sence to dublicate a bot while using the same car for all.
              At the moment we do not have a team that is reachable for new racers. This was, why I was thinking about a simplix_2020, driving well without needing a setup for each track. This way a new racer would have a chance to use it as target to beat for future races.

              > Hunt down these bugs
              I have to say that I'm not able to hunt them down. While learning my bot crashes sometimes (with VC2013, access violation, release mode). Running in debug mode it never crashes. I tried to use try and catch code, but it never catches an exception, it just crashes TORCS. I made a map file to get info about the location where it crashes, but the routine identfied cannot be the reason.
              Last Edited: 2019-05-30 17:02:41 by wdbee
                Author: dummy | Created: 2019-05-30 17:47:50
                Subject: Re: Alpine 2
                News update: There is a rumor that Autobot has been steeling code from Robotec. The racing commission is looking into this troubling development and may disqualify Autobot from the rest of the championship. Sadly this would be the 4th team the championship loses this year. However it's not known what's going on with team JSR. Maybe they'll show up in the next race and we'll have again 7 teams :)

                Joking aside looking forward to Simplix 2020. A candidate for Eliam's idea of a Pro/Am championship.

                EDIT: News update 2
                The racing commission decided that Autobot will be allowed to stay in the championship, if they only use one default configuration that works for all tracks, thus making them considerably slower.
                Last Edited: 2019-05-30 18:01:39 by dummy
                  Author: phi | Created: 2019-05-31 08:50:49
                  Subject: Re: Alpine 2
                  The racing commission is very wise. Here the rumours has it that they did it just to show they are there and that they also have the right to have fun. At first glance it seems to be something from another world, but... I don't know.

                  I regret what happened to Autobot, but I believe the racing commission has the best of intentions. Someone told me that he saw them talking animatedly in the lobby of a hotel where happen the conference "What is different is good and makes things go. True or false?", just before the final decision on Autobot was announced. Who knows? perhaps they just wanted to emphasize and foster a little more difference, to shake things up.

                  I hope Autobot is well, and that all this does not take him away the concentration necessary to stay on track in the next races.
                  Last Edited: 2019-05-31 08:50:49 by phi
                  Author: jspenn | Created: 2019-05-31 10:28:19
                  Subject: Re: Alpine 2
                  JSR have had some... team issues recently. It has transpired that Jay and Jake have taken an unauthorised holiday, and in true JSR fashion, have crashed into a deer and spun into the sea. We are awaiting their *incredibly* humane capture with *no chloroform whatsoever*, and should make the race at Wheel 1.
                  Last Edited: 2019-05-31 10:28:19 by jspenn
                  Author: firechief | Created: 2019-06-03 02:32:43
                  Subject: Re: Alpine 2
                  Haha ... I so wish I was there racing with you guys :)
                  Last Edited: 2019-06-03 02:32:43 by firechief
                    Author: dummy | Created: 2019-06-03 05:47:01
                    Subject: Re: Alpine 2
                    This will be an interesting year. Looking forward to next year as well.
                    Last Edited: 2019-06-03 05:47:01 by dummy
                      Author: firechief | Created: 2019-06-05 05:12:20
                      Subject: Re: Alpine 2
                      Actually, alpine-2 was the only track I had any time to create a setup for ... and I'd have qualified 9th and 10th. Seems I'll have some work to do in order to be competitive for next year :)
                      Last Edited: 2019-06-05 05:12:20 by firechief